By Chuck Beatty more
24 August 2006
Context: "Lily" is an identity posting on the
newsgroup alt.religion.scientology, who attempt regularly to
confuse newcomers into not finding out more critical materials
about Scientology. It is strongly suspected that "Lily" is a
member of the Church of Scientology.
Well, my thoughts are that you are a well intentioned man or
woman living in Austria, which might explain your repeating that
you are NOT a Scientologist nor have anything to do with
Scientology, because over there the normal middle class person's
fear of being in ANY way associated with Scientology is very
I appreciate, and ex Sea
Org members who have read your and Truthseeker's posts, who
commented to me, appreciate only ONE aspect of your and
Truthseeker's posts, which is where you recommend people go to
the FBI, go to police, and all the other list of regular
I thank you for reminding people of doing that simple thing!
That IS the right thing.
I myself was in the Happy Valley
RPF (rehabilitation project
force, which is the Sea Org's redemption program to supposedly
redeem fallen Sea Org members from the top ranks of the Sea
Org), and there were long periods of time where daily I
contemplated going to the police, and asking for help.
So I can tell you, encouraging the Sea Org members who feel
trapped, who are physically restrained, who feel they are being
held against their will, I agree with you completely, and I wish
the message could somehow be gotten to them.
It IS okay for them to ask for help from the police, if they
feel trapped and restrained from leaving.
It is truly one of the most uncomfortable feelings, and I
felt it, for months, I was contemplating escaping ("blowing" is
the slang word in Scientology).
But I never decided fully to blow because I felt that it was
ridiculous and dishonorable.
I felt that instead the church should revise and speed up the
I tried leaving the first time, Jan 1997 until August 1997, I
failed, and decided to stay.
I was convinced to stay, and I regret that I allowed myself
to be convinced to stay for an additional 5 and 1/2 years. (I
was almost 7 years on the RPF.)
In my case, in Jan 1997 I was on the RPF, I told my fellow
members on the RPF that I wished to leave the Sea Org. That
resulted in a 7 month procedure that I saw I was NOT close to
completing even after 7 months. That of course is ridiculous
So it was during this frustrating period of 7 months while I
was going through the procedures for leaving the church, that I
then began contemplating escaping, and pushing that idea aside,
then I contemplated simply openly walking to the security guard
who attended the RPF camp, and informing that person that I
wished to leave, and just openly leave, but I knew the results
of openly leaving would result in my physical restraints most
likely, and that a physical struggle I contemplated would then
escalate into a fight and then escalate to me requesting help
from the police.
So, your encouragement for people to go to the police, for
the people who were in situations in the Sea Org (the lifetime
staffer bureaucrats who administer the upper structure of the
church of Scientology) is relevant.
Let me explain details about life for the people who would
appreciate your and Truthseeker's message, the part of the
message you spread which is valuable I feel.
It is during the frustrating predicaments and moments when
Sea Org members WISH to leave, and are prevented, are slowed
down by the bureaucratic rules, it is THERE that the people
wishing to leave SHOULD have access to police, so they can
complain, and get outside help to get OUT.
I had been in the Sea Org for 27 years, from 1975 until March
2003, and in Feb and Mar 2003, while I was waiting for my final
final bureaucratic authorization to leave the Sea Org, I
proclaimed I was going to the public library, and I did so.
I mention going to the library, even while I was in the RPF
because RPF members are NOT allowed to do such things. I was
allowed, simply because I threatened worse things. I threatened
going to the LA Times newspaper and I threatened seeking a
lawyer because I knew it was NOT correct that the procedures for
leaving the Sea Org should take that long (I had been waiting
over a years, from Dec 2001 until Dec 2002 my second attempt and
final attempt to "standardly" leave the Sea Org).
At one of the LA public library branches, where I went daily,
with a person assigned to accompany me so I didn't escape (they
wouldn't have restrained me physically, they just were with me
and would have reported back to the RPF and back to the church
security guards had I run off, but I didn't intend to run away
since I'd waited months and months through the procedures, so
planned rather to complete the procedures), anyways at the
library I looked on the internet, first for job information.
Then I started looking at the sites on L. Ron Hubbard, "Ron
the War Hero" or something like that. Critical sites. Then I
saw Arnie Lerma's
site. I dared not look
too much at these sites, I thought I will have time later to
look at all these sites.
It would have been a chance in a million if I would have
found the messages you or Truthseeker post here, which is the
point of me saying all the above.
I WOULD have appreciated YOUR post above, only the part of
your post where you strongly encourage people to go to the FBI
That part of your message truly is good.
However you promote that message, I applaud you for it.
Thank you for that part of your postings.
I believe, from your answers, that you are a well intentioned
Austrian middle class person, who like you say, has nothing to
do with Scientology, and who only wishes somehow to get the
message of common sense, telling those members, like I WAS, like
I described above, and I can tell you, if you were in Los
Angeles, on a street corner, and you politely and in a friendly
helpful way carried a sign or handed me a leaflet with a
friendly easily understood leaflet of information on my rights
to seek police or other help, in escaping from the restraints of
being in the RPF, and if you looked like a decent and kind and
understanding person, and you looked like someone who
understands compassionately the predicaments of the people who
are at times in the Sea Org in these frustrating predicaments,
THEN I would have gladly stopped, taken a leaflet from you, and
I would have read it, and I might have just walked out, called
the police and asked for help.
So Lily, thank you if your intent was anything aligning with
helping the people who are in the predicaments.
ARS is an
advanced critics site. Some people posting here have been doing
battle with Scn for over a decade.
The people who really need your advice, were ME! About 3 and
1/2 years ago, like I said, had I seen looking like a decent
compassionate, smart, understanding and cheerful face on a
street corner near the RPF facilities in Los Angeles, and you
handed me a 1 page leaflet with a simply written message saying
I had a right to go to the police if I felt I was being
restrained against my will, or that gave me a phone number for
outside advice how to leave the Sea Org more quickly, THEN I
would have wished to give you a big hug.
There are a few people inside, who would appreciate that part
of your post above, the part that encourages people to seek help
from society's institutions that are set up to help people who
are in abusive situations.
Not all the Sea Org members find themselves at all times in
the extreme abusive situations. Mostly the abusive predicaments
that frustrate Sea Org members come when the Sea Org members
asks to leave the Sea Org, and the Sea Org and Scientology rules
act as a restraining barrier from letting the person leave
within a reasonable amount of time. These are the times I would
have liked to have had someone like you handing me the message
you post on the internet.
Glad you respond quickly. Thanks for your efforts. The
people you wish to reach, I can tell you where they sit, at this
minute. There are always a small group of RPF members who are
asking to "route out" (route out is the name of the procedure
for leaving the Sea Org, leaving their lifetime commitment to
being in the Sea Org). It is amongst those people who are
walking around the hallways which the RPF members are allowed to
walk in, in the big blue building in LA. RPFers wishing to leave
are seperated most of the time from all staff and the rest of
the RPFers. The RPFers who are wishing to leave, the ones who
might be frustrated with the procedures for leaving, like I was,
would be the ones you might want to get your message to.
If you or others want to discuss how to get your important
advice to those people who need to have the support and advice,
that would be a good thing.
Depending on the day to day treatment of the people who wish
to leave, those are the people most needing your message.
There are at all times others in the Sea Org, who suddenly
"blow" (escape without authorization, without going through the
Sea Org procedures for leaving, called "routing out"), and those
people also might benefit from your message.
I suggest you ignore the OSA
people working here, and repeat the most valuable part of your
message, the part about going to authorities, and also I think
you should also connect with some of us who are public, who are
willing to network the people coming out to their old friends.
That's what I do.
There are OSA people, volunteers, working on ARS and other
sites. Sure, and us ex members know who the actual Sea Org
people are, Gloria Idda, and others like Lynn Farney, those are
two Office of Special Affairs staff right there at the
HGB building, which
I worked in, on the same floor where my ex wife works today
still, Gloria and Lynn will read my and your conversation later
today or this week sometime.
I being a former member, all my posts on the internet go into
a file, so if they choose to ever take action against me, they
have all my public writings, etc., etc.
Realize that the people who worked for the church, for
decades, me it was 27 years (my final 6-7 years I spent in the
RPF groups), many of us appreciate the small and large parts of
the critical internet sites and chat groups for the good
information amongst all the other chatter.
The good part of your and Truthseeker's messages are buried
though, and I suggest if you want to help get the good message
("go to authorities") across, that you simplify to it.
I coming out, was bewildered by all the layers of
conversation on ARS, when I came out.
It has taken me a year, I've met and talked on the phone with
dozens of the main critics
It is only after almost 2 years now, of talking and
interacting with the dozens of people, do I understand better.
It is confusing, but if you really want to meet the people, I
see your circumstances are that you are in Austria, fine,
calling me is not an option, but I am free to hear from anyone,
at anytime, by email, by phone.
I am known by thousands of Scientologists, because I
interacted with thousands during my years working with them.
I'll talk to any of them, and give advice if they ask, or
hear their stories, or just say hello.
The people who get to this level of internet surfing, looking
on ARS, are pretty advanced.
Clambake is easier, and
you will notice that the latest people going public, go to
Clambake first, simply because it is easier to get onto ARS and
post and chat there.
The people you wish to reach with your positive advice to go
to authorities, those people are behind the walls in the RPF
groups, and are the Sea Org members who won't unfortunately hear
your messages. Only exceptions, like me, where I insisted on
going to the library, only I had a small chance of hearing your
message, but when I went to the library and got on the internet
I had NOT figured out how to get onto ARS.
Helping get a leaflet listing people's rights to go to
authorities for any violations like of freedom to leave the
church and freedom NOT to be under "watch" or restraints, or
freedom NOT to have to suffer through months and months of the
Sea Org leaving procedures, THAT would be a positive good thing.
It is psychologically demeaning to have to withstand the months
and months of leaving procedures. I did it twice, and luckily I
was successful my second attempt. I could have "blown", but I
wanted instead for the church to revise the procedures, and make
them shorter. Which in most cases I heard after I left, it was
speeded up, which I was happy to hear.
The best part of your message, again, is the fact that you
call on people to go to society's outside existing institutions
I totally agree, because Scientology isolates itself from
society's institutions, and the abuses in Scientology's staff
hierarchies need at times outside intervention.
Best, Chuck Beatty